Thursday, November 26, 2020
Home Special Reports Whistleblowers Claim NOAA Rushed Contentious 'Pause' Buster Study Despite Reservations

Whistleblowers Claim NOAA Rushed Contentious ‘Pause’ Buster Study Despite Reservations

-

Note: CFACT’s new skeptical documentary, Climate Hustle, is set to rock the UN climate summit with ‘red carpet’ world premiere in Paris. 

#

Via: http://www.thegwpf.com/whistleblowers-claim-noaa-rushed-contentious-climate-paper-despite-reservations/

Whistleblowers Claim NOAA Rushed Contentious Climate Paper Despite Reservations

Date: 19/11/15

Lisa Rein, The Washington Post

House Science Committee Chairman Lamar Smith (R-Tex.) opened another front in his war with federal climate researchers on Wednesday, saying a groundbreaking global warming study was “rushed to publication” over the objections of numerous scientists at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration.

In a second letter in less than a week to Commerce Secretary Penny Pritzker, Smith urged her to pressure NOAA to comply with his subpoena for internal communications. Smith says whistleblowers have come forward with new information on the climate study’s path to publication in June. The study refuted claims that global warming had “paused” or slowed over the past decade, undercutting a popular argument used by those who refute the scientific consensus that man-made pollution is behind global warming.

The research, considered a bombshell in the climate change debate, set off alarms among skeptics. Smith, a prominent congressional skeptic, claimed that scientists manipulated data to advance President Obama’s agenda and timed the study’s release to coincide the the administration’s new limits on emissions from coal plants.

He is seeking NOAA’s internal communications and e-mails among its researchers, and in October subpoenaed Administrator Kathryn Sullivan for the documents. But she has refused to turn them over, saying that deliberative communications between scientists should be protected.

Smith told Pritzker that the whistleblowers’ allegations make it more crucial that he be provided with the scientists’ internal e-mails and communications. If NOAA does not produce the e-mails he is seeking by Friday, the chairman said, “I will be forced to consider use of compulsory process,” a threat to subpoena the commerce secretary herself.

Whistleblowers have told the committee, according to Smith’s letter, that Thomas Karl — the director of NOAA’s National Centers for Environmental Information, which led the study — “rushed” to publish the climate study “before all appropriate reviews of the underlying science and new methodologies” used in the climate data sets were conducted.

Full story

#

Related Links: 

Meanwhile, Satellite data reveals the temperature ‘pause’ is alive and well. No global warming at all for 18 years 9 months – a new record – The Pause lengthens again – just in time for UN Summit in Paris

Climate scientists to be grilled by congressional investigators, but their e-mails are still off-limits

The Next Climategate? NOAA Refuses To Comply With US Congress Subpoena

Former Harvard Physicist Dr. Lubos Motl: Karl et al. hiatus killer is ‘research’ that began with conclusions

1315 COMMENTS

  1. These people want to get there agenda in place because they know a mini ice age is coming and want to take credit for it by saying “See we where right and now we are seeing the results by the fact that the earth is cooling” It is all one big money scheme to get control of the people and their money.

  2. This is common in a bureaucracy, management technique No. 37, give technical reviewers one day to review a detailed document which took months to write.

    Two conclusions are obvious.

    Any communication between government employees below the policy level, belongs to the public. We paid for and own the “papers” (which are probably digital records). Ergo employees who wipe hard disks with a rag or crash their server, are thieves and should see the inside of a jail cell.

    Until the fact of the hiatus or non hiatus is settled, there can be no progress in Paris on addressing climate change. It may not be changing.

    Government official lie by omission. This must stop.

      • You comprehend our national political trends.

        If one party lies through its teeth, it does not follow that the other party tells the truth.

        At that point, you look outside the political herd for anyone who is smart and honest. I am still looking.

            • Why not ? It’s all become politics. I reckon that Lt. Col. Hackworth had it right we he said: “Figures don’t lie but liars figure”.

              Lush government research grants and prestige are reserved for those that successfully pilot the “getaway car” or provide an alibi.

              • If you liars could figure then you would be able to challenge the science.

                But you can’t. You just don’t have the ability or the competence.

                So you spend your days, whining and moaning, and lying.

                Tea Baggers are almost entirely comprised of old American Republicans who are close to death.

                That makes me laugh.

                • “You just don’t have the ability or the competence”

                  How rich ! How ironic! As if YOU do! RIGHT! You have no clue. You have ZERO evidence that CO2 is causing the Earth to warm. Just appeals to authority, that’s it! There are plenty of HONEST scientists who question your “science”. People without a doubt more credentials and 100 times smarter than you. YOU? You are just a blowhard spouting off as if you knew something. Can you even think on your own? I doubt it.

                  • “You have ZERO evidence that CO2 is causing the Earth to warm.” – Kook

                    The fact that CO2 has an absorption spectrum means that it must do so.

                    If you can’t comprehend that then you aren’t smart enough to be commenting on the subject.

                    Your words have an information content equivalent to that of a dog barking.

                    • As I said, you have no clue! You seem to forget ALL the other factors that come into play when it comes to climate dynamics. If YOU can’t comprehend THAT then YOU aren’t smart enough to even weigh in on the subject. Case closed, kook.

                    • All those other factors like the color of your cat, the weight of your pickup truck, the number of teeth you are missing etc.

                    • You can’t even respond logically! Yet you think you should be taken seriously? Your response confirms that you know very little about climate dynamics. You are a simpleton. Expert in high energy physics? Yeah, right!!!….LMAO!!!! A fraud you are at that!!

                    • I’m still waiting for all these unconsidered “factors” that you have implied change the measured fact that the globe is rapidly warming.

                      Waiting… Waiting… Waiting for the toothless Denialists to do anything but lie.

                    • You wouldn’t understand them given that you don’t even consider them. You are way too shallow. Thanks for playing, kook.

                    • I’m still waiting. And it is now self evident that you were lying when you claimed you knew of unconsidered “factors”.

                      Lying is what Repubicans do
                      Lying is what Republicans live for
                      Lying is a way of life for Republicans
                      Lies are what Republicans are

                      Thank you for once again illustrating this so clearly.

                    • Actually my response shows that you shouldn’t be taken seriously.

                      Your posts are content free nonsense.

                    • Yup. The energy remains near the surface of the earth longer, thus increasing the temperature of the surface.

                      Denialists just can’t imagine how that works.

                      Such stupidity.

                    • Over night. But people like yourself like to talk about how hot it is in the daytime. And all the missing heat which you say is in the ocean per the ghg rules can’t warm the oceans. So where is the missing heat? There is a lot of stupidity on these boards but the main source is VendicarDecarian0,

                    • Are you trying to say that energy knows that time of day it is?

                      Sorry boy, but that is something that only a true kook wouid claim.

                    • No, I’m saying you don’t understand the GHG theory.

                      I live in Denver where it is semiarid. The difference between day and night is approximately 30 degrees. Houston is very humid and the difference between day and night is approximately 10 degrees. That VD is what green house gases do.

                    • CO2 of course has the same effect but differs in magnitude because CO2 is not as potent a greenhouse gas as water vapor.

                      CO2, because it increases the base line temperature of the atmosphere, enhances evaporation and hence causes the overall humidity o teh atmosphere to increase.

                      This humidity increase is also being directly observed.

                    • Actually the humidity increase is not going as predicted. The hot spot is a function of this and is nowhere to be seen. The alarmist hypothesis posits this addition water vapor actually breaking up the low level clouds and
                      forming high level Cirrus clouds that will trap more heat. This in turn will raise the temperature even more and eventually (although the AGW supporters see this as happening soon) you will hit tipping points where permafrost starts to melt, bogs start to warm and all of these give up more and more greenhouse gases causing a runaway greenhouse effect which will raise the temperature even more, melt the ice at the poles and raise the ocean levels by 20 to 30 feet. It is from this that we find the disaster scenarios we keep hearing about in the press.

                      Skeptics also see CO2 as increasing water vapor, but they see this water vapor acting as a net negative feedback. Rather than break up low level clouds, skeptics see the water vapor adding to the low, thick clouds (such as stratocumulus) which primarily reflect incoming solar radiation back into space. This would negate the formation of a hot spot and cool the planet. In addition, these low level clouds will cause rain to fall which also acts as a cooling mechanism to the planet.

                      In Spencer et al. (2007) found a strong negative cirrus cloud feedback mechanism in the tropical troposphere. Instead of steadily building up as the tropical oceans warm, cirrus cloud cover suddenly contracts, allowing more OLR to escape (this is the iris effect that the alarmist are scared to death of and continual try to say it’s dead). Dr. Roy Spencer of the University of Alabama in Huntsville, who directed the study, estimates that if this mechanism operates on decadal time scales, it would reduce model estimates of global warming by 75%. The latest study on this the authors Thorsten Mauritsen and Bjorn Stevens who in the abstract say: “models underestimate some of the changes in the hydrological cycle. These discrepancies raise the possibility that important feedbacks are missing from the models (duh, do you think that might be possible? LOL). A controversial hypothesis suggests that the dry and clear regions of the tropical atmosphere expand in a warming climate and thereby allow more infrared radiation to escape to space. This so-called iris effect could constitute a negative feedback that is not included in climate models. We find that inclusion of such an effect in a climate model moves the simulated responses of both temperature and the hydrological cycle to rising atmospheric greenhouse gas concentrations closer to observations

                      That my friend is the argument that is going on. As James Lovelock said a few years ago, “.The great climate science centres around the world are more than well aware how weak their science is. If you talk to them privately they’re scared stiff of the fact that they don’t really know what the clouds and the aerosols are doing. They could be absolutely running the show. We haven’t got the physics worked out yet….

                    • “all the missing heat which you say is in the ocean per the ghg rules can’t warm the oceans.” – Goodspkr

                      What the hell are you jabbering about.. Kook.

                    • Yup, it delays the return of energy to space meaning it keeps it near the earth’s surface longer, and hence causes the Earth’s surface temperature to increase.

                      It is pretty trivial.

                  • If you liars could figure then you would be able to challenge the science.

                    But you can’t. You just don’t have the ability or the competence.

                    So you spend your days, whining and moaning, and lying.

                    Tea Baggers are almost entirely comprised of old American Republicans who are close to death.

                    That makes me laugh.

                    • The “Burden of Proof” is not on “deniers” but is on the scientific community to accurately support their claims. Every model produced has been proven false. The only way any of their “predictions” even come close is for the scientific community to constantly massage the data. Even now, they do not have the full picture of atmospheric impacts… but they foist their “results” on the world as gospel.

                    • VD and others keep saying we need to challenge their science. Actually the null hypothesis is that any warming is due to nature and the alarmists haven’t been able to disprove that. A couple of years ago Trenberth and Curry and dueling articles about this with Trenberth wanting to change the null hypothesis with disproving that any warming is natural.

                      It really makes them mad when you say, I don’t have to disprove AGW. You have disprove the null hypothesis.

                    • And they have done so. But barking dogs do not listen, they do not hear, and they can not comprehend.

                      So the barking dogs, just continue to bark their ignorance.

                      This is why everyone is laughing at you losers.

                    • VD you don’t realize who much like used car salesmen the climate groups sounds like. And while we don’t laugh at you,because you are irritating, you keep losing the sale.

                    • Am I supposed to be impressed by that comment.

                      But after reading your responses I will say you are more knowledgeable than most of the alarmists on the internet. You have at least a passing knowledge of what the alarmist side of the argument is. But you haven’t looked at both sides. When I first started to look at this I did look at both sides and what I concluded was that the alarmists side consisted of a lot less than was being put forward. They had a hypothesis was it was full of holes. Instead of investigating these holes the alarmist side has tried to cover up the holes through modifying data, ad hominem attacks on any one who disagrees (denialists–give me a break), and using a single study to say something is proven or disproven. The alarmist side has really hurt science. You can read about it here.

                      The Climate Wars’ Damage to Science

                      http://quadrant.org.au/magazine/2015/06/climate-wars-done-science/

                    • Aww, it must hurt your little feelings to wake up each morning, only to realize that you alarmists are the ones being laughed at more and more. And yes, you are correct, the barking dogs continue to bark their ignorance… such a shame that it’s actually the alarmists “barking”.

                    • If the science isn’t being challenged why are the alarmists asking people not to publish what you call denialists ideas. And others have suggested we prosecute them under the RICO act. Yeah, VD, as James Lovelock admitted two years ago,

                      “The great climate science centres around the world are more than well aware how weak their science is. If you talk to them privately they’re scared stiff of the fact that they don’t really know what the clouds and the aerosols are doing. They could be absolutely running the show. We haven’t got the physics worked out yet….”

                • But here’s your problem. The AGW hypothesis fails the Scientific Method. There’s no hot spot and the current models simulations used in the AR5 indicate that the warming stagnation since 1998 is no longer consistent with model
                  projections even at the 2% confidence level. Below 5% you throw out the concept.

                  Part of the scientific method says, ” If any exception to a concept can be proven by observation, the concept is wrong.”

                    • Your time frame has no basis in reality. Another alarmist prediction that will be proven wrong. Based on the extremely rapid rate of temperature rise of .5 degrees centigrade that began in the late 1800’s, it will take 400 to 800 years to reach the normal highs of every inter-glacial warm up of the past 500,000 years as the black temperature line on this NOAA chart so vividly points out.

                      http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/abrupt/data2.html

              • by jove, I think you have something there! so, in reality, all of the climate scientists are actually willing participants in a Grand Conspiracy, designed to dupe the rest of the world, so they can get paid. Because that’s what scientists do-take bribes. All of ’em. Brilliant!

                • Is the scientist scientist doing “serious” research work ? Does he need grants from political entities to continue his / her work ? He / She had better play along to get along. $$$
                  Everyone already knows that “we” being “frail humans” subject everything through a lens of politics. The scientific peer review process is one of the most incestuous institutions on the planet. How many generations must die before a paradigm change can be effected ? Very tough regardless of the magnitude of the “evidence”.
                  So even if the scientist has his own funds and is doing his own research… getting it published is not going to happen for those who are outside of the political fold. In fact the “mob” gets hostile. Many a brilliant mind disdains being a combatant, especially for or against a topic they personally are not passionate about. Better for their work to just keep their mouth shut or tell the activists what they want to hear.

            • No its simply impossible the entire system is full of systematic errors so any such attempted calculation down to a usable range will be wrong. The error is thinking that multiple readings decrease error. This is not true when systematic error dominates.

              Even the Karl adjustment is an example of systematic error. They are adjusting for ship intakes heating the water. This is not random error. Its systematic error and it is only one. There are numerous known and unknown systematic errors in the global measurement system.

              • Your first sentence is incoherent.

                Your second and third sentences are coherent but you fail to tell us what you think the systematic errors are?

                If you know of any then write a paper, get it peer reviewed and published.

                • Ah the other leftist come back. Why don’t you write a paper on it. That generally means I really don’t know what I’m talking about.

                  So VD,gives us a quick version of what the hypothesis of the alarmists is. What is going to destroy the ice caps, raise the oceans 80 feet, etc. In your own word please, not links.

                  • Would’t the Denialist’s ability to not write a paper on it indicate that they don’t know what they are talking about?

                    After all, if they did know what they were talking about they could actually write a paper on it.

                    But they can’t, even after 30 years of trying.

                    Ahahahahahahahahah.. Now that is what I call incompetence.

                    • No, what I want to see is if you actually know what you are pretending to believe in with your whole heart and soul. If it is correct you should be able to give us the basics. What I find is most alarmists like yourself refuse to say anything about the actual science because they don’t know it.

                • There are plenty of papers addressing the problem of confidence intervals when dealing of data having systematic errors. Climate scientists simply choose to ignore such warnings. Such a paper would not be very original.

                  And I know what a systematic error is you goggling dumbass.

                  • You should write one concerning these unstated and magical “systematic errors” that you allege are in the climate record.

                    Why are you keeping them a secret?

                    Maybe it’s because you have a big mouth and like to use it to lie.

                    • Unstated and magical. I’m sorry you are simply stupid. All of the errors adjusted for in the data sets are systematic errors. TOBIS is a systematic error, UHI is systematic error, ship intake is a systematic error.

                      None of this is secret. You are just too stupid to understand it.

                    • And as we all know, including UHI in the data set actually lowers the overall surface temperature record.

                      It’s one of the reasons that you losers are laughed at.

                      As for TOBIS, that is just a nonsense term you have fabricated.

          • And there it is! Real science vs junk science! At one time or another in human history, alchemy, astrology, drapetomania and phrenology were considered ‘real’. Global Warming will soon join them all on the trash heap of junk science!

                    • Over the last 10,000 years the global temperature has been in a slow decline until 100 years ago when it began to rapidly rise.

                    • Global temps have been rising since the end of the last Ice Age. Rising temps care what CAUSED the Ice Age to end.

                    • My goodness. You are so stupid that you can’t even interpret a simple graph.

                      The graph above calls you a liar.

                      So do I.

                    • Put the chart in the real historical perspective deceptive moron.

                      Even at the extremely rapid increase in average earth temperature of .5 degrees centigrade per 100 years, it will take 400 to 800 years to reach the normal naturally occurring high temperatures of ALL inter-glacial warmups of the past 500,000 years. That according to the black temperature line on the NOAA web site which also illustrates your graph in a more realistic format, which is about 1/2 the yellow shaded area in this NOAA chart. Nothing like providing a deceptive look by cherry picking part of the historical record.
                      http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/abrupt/data2.html

                    • “400 to 800 years” – Kook

                      Not according to the graphic you provided. We are already 1’C warmer than the historical averages and just 2’C cooler than the peak temperature attained in the last three interglacials.

                      Currently we are warmer now than at any time in the last 120,000 years, and a rise of 2’C is anticipated sometime around 2110 provided CO2 production is dramatically reduced to near zero – which you oppose.

                      So the science tells us that we will be just a but under or just a bit over the warmest temps seen in the last few interglacials by 2110, and disastrously higher if your plan of inaction is chosen..

                    • If you knew anything about the climate change trend over the past million years since the 40,000 orbital cycle was overpowered by the 100,000 glacial cycle, you would know that the cycle trend is for increasing extremes, colder lows and warmer warms. If we do not have warmer warms in the next 1000 years or so I will be surprised and will eat my words. Will you eat your words when your predictions do not occur in 150 years? “Scientists” seem to be refusing to eat their words as all their predictions since the 70’s have failed one after another.

                    • Who says you are real?

                      Maybe your are a fart who thinks it’s a person.

                      That would certainly explain your low IQ.

                    • Oh now you’re measuring IQ via telekinesis and the internet. Who’s the idiot? Stooping to personal insults. A class act indeed. Why not try and prove something instead of trotting out silly charts and lame claims. There have been more scandals in the “global warming” community and more refuted claims in the last 5 years than any other branch of science and you know it. Grow a pair and bring something real to the table, lose the propaganda. Notice I’m not showing anything like the recent NASA study on Antarctic ice or anything else. I’ve already burned way too many calories on you. Go peddle your papers.

                    • No need to use telekinesis. We can estimate your low IQ scores from the stupidity that you have demonstrated in your posts.

                    • Still masturbating into your sister’s used crusty panties? I have a live and let live attitude, but PLEASE tell your mother to quit emailing me about your disgusting habits!

                    • Even at the extremely rapid increase in average earth temperature of .5 degrees centigrade per 100 years, it will take 400 to 800 years to reach the normal naturally occurring high temperatures of ALL inter-glacial warmups of the past 500,000 years. That according to the black temperature line on the NOAA web site which also illustrates your graph in a more realistic format.

                      http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/abrupt/data2.html

                    • “400 to 800 years” – Kook

                      Not according to the graphic you provided. We are already 1’C warmer than the historical averages and just 2’C cooler than the peak temperature attained in the last three interglacials.

                      Currently we are warmer now than at any time in the last 120,000 years, and a rise of 2’C is anticipated sometime around 2110 provided CO2 production is dramatically reduced to near zero – which you oppose.

                      So the science tells us that we will be just a but under or just a bit over the warmest temps seen in the last few interglacials by 2110, and disastrously higher if your plan of inaction is chosen.

                    • DECEPTION!!! 120,000 years does not include the last inter-glacial warm up high temperatures. 130,000 would and we are NOT warmer than at any time in the past 130,000 years. People that need to use deception show their true colors.

                    • No scientists are voting to decide if something is valid.

                      They are polled to see what the scientific consensus opinion is

                      How sad for you that it is 100% against your ideological preferences.

                    • Science is NOT consensus, and consensus is NOT science. I can attest to that fact .

                      U.N. Official Reveals Real Reason Behind Warming Scare
                      IBD Editorials, 02/10/2015 06:43 PM ET
                      LINK: http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/021015-738779-climate-change-scare-tool-to-destroy-capitalism.htm

                      U.N. climate chief Christiana Figueres speaks during an interview at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland, on Jan. 22, 2014. AP View Enlarged Image

                      Economic Systems: The alarmists keep telling us their concern about global warming is all about man’s stewardship of the environment.
                      But we know that’s not true. A United Nations official has now confirmed this.

                      At a news conference last week in Brussels, Christiana Figueres, executive secretary of U.N.’s Framework Convention on Climate Change, admitted that the goal of environmental activists is not to save the world from ecological calamity but to destroy capitalism.

                      “This is the first time in the history of mankind that we are setting ourselves the task of intentionally, within a defined period of time, to change the economic development model that has been reigning for at least 150 years, since the Industrial Revolution,” she said.

                      Referring to a new international treaty environmentalists hope will be adopted at the Paris climate change conference later this year, she added: “This is probably the most difficult task we have ever given ourselves, which is to intentionally transform the economic development model for the first time in human history.”

                      The only economic model in the last 150 years that has ever worked at all is capitalism. The evidence is prima facie: From a feudal order that lasted a thousand years, produced zero growth and kept workdays long and lifespans short, the countries that have embraced free-market capitalism have enjoyed a system in which output has increased 70-fold, work days have been halved and lifespans doubled.

                      Figueres is perhaps the perfect person for the job of transforming “the economic development model” because she’s really never seen it work. “If you look at Ms. Figueres’ Wikipedia page,” notes Cato economist Dan Mitchell: Making the world look at their right hand while they choke developed economies with their left.

                    • An opinion piece in

                      IBD = Quack central.

                      in which the claim made doesn’t even begin to honestly begin to reflect what was said.

                      What was said.

                      “This is probably the most difficult task we have ever given ourselves, which is to intentionally transform the economic development model for the first time in human history.”

                      The Lie told by IBD in the editorial.

                      “is not to save the world from ecological calamity but to destroy capitalism.”

                      The author of the liar in the IBD editorial is not named, but it is most certainly someone who works for the Fascist promoting CATO institute.

                    • let’s see…polling to see if they agree is REALLY DIFFERENT from voting to see if something is VALID?

                      The retards are the people who have scientists POLLED to decide if they AGREE that something
                      is valid…what happened to the scientific method??

                      Question: Are
                      you paid to be an azzwhole or do you do it for free?

              • This means nothing. Where is it written that one years weather or temperatures are an indicator of anything? It is just another data point. People like to use the draught in California as evidence that global warming is occurring. Maybe so, maybe not. The areas of California now having a water crisis have been a desert environment long before California saw its first white person. They have simply ignored their predicament for decades upon decades until they cannot ignore it any longer. That has nothing to do with the climate and everything to do with stupidity and greed. Let’s stop subverting the scientific community into a left wing political community. It’s disgusting even by liberal standards.

                  • Another deceptive graph of “moving averages” cherry picking statistical information is the wonderful deception used by all climate alarmists. Reality shows a temperature plateau in the approximate 1940’s area similar to the current plateau. Both are ignored and called eccentric or eccentricity by those whose math cannot understand why. Like I do not understand my Aunt Millie’s eccentricity so I ignore it. They do not take what they call the “100,000 year problem” into account in their computer models… and they wonder why all their predictions are proven wrong.
                    They ignore the “100,000 year problem” because over the past 500,000 years it proves all their fear mongering is just that… fear mongering deceptive lies.

              • With the “adjusted” data. And don’t forget that our direct temperature data does not go back more than 200 years even for the areas of the world that are “civilized” and much less for other areas.

                • Well, the MWP was erased in the hockey stick as a blip, so alarmists don’t count that. They also came to the conclusion with a nicely colored map, that the Northern Hemisphere (especially Greenland and Northern Europe) were warmer than normal but the rest of the world was cool. Considering the awesomely accurate temperature gauges of the natives of Australia, South America, and Sub-Sahara Africa, we can be assured they have accurate records.

                    • Actually it was global but happened at different times in different areas. It was more sequential than simultaneous. Sad that more are not aware of that rebuke of that time-untested talking point.

                    • CO2 is present in the atmosphere in such a minute quantity that it’s actually funny that anyone believes it has ANY effect at all. The “greenhouse effect” is cause by WATER VAPOR. Anyone who lives in a dry desert can attest to that. (Blazing hot in the day, instantly cold at night when the sun goes down.)

                      The CO2 concentration is driven by climate, not the other way around.

                    • and of course the CO2 that is dumpted into the atmosphere by man just vanishes.

                      Mooooooooorrrrrrrrrrrroooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnn.

                    • Are you aware that CO2 levels RISE when there are sunspots and DECREASE when the sun is a quiescent state? Algore had it EXACTLY backward in his book. He is a nimrod. Carbon does not CAUSE warming. Warming from the SUN causes carbon levels to rise.

                    • And we know this how? Satellite readings from 950-1250? Surface temperatures from the aborigines, Mayans, Incas, and the tribes on sub-Sahara Africa? Considering the unreliability of these charlatans on everything else, I wouldn’t trust them for anything.

                      Just f’ing amazing that the MWP map ONLY shows Greenland and Northern Europe as warmer with everything else cooler. BS.

                    • What we do know from 40,000 years ago and more is that, during the height of the Pleistocene glaciations, the CO2 concentration in the atmosphere was several times HIGHER than it is today. (Ice core studies.) Which make sense: Cold climate = less biomass = more free atmospheric carbon.

                      One issue the Warmists NEVER talk about is how much actual fossil carbon human beings have added to the cycle, as compared to the total amount in the cycle. The figure is absolutely negligible. When you compare what we’ve released to the total it’s laughable to suggest that we’re having any effect on the “greenhouse effect.” The fact is the total CO2 and methane in the atmosphere are only a few thousandths of one percent. The ONLY greenhouse gas that has any effect is water vapor.

                    • They also ignore the fact that in the ice cores, CO2 increases lag warming rather than leading it. It’s an effect, not a cause.

                    • Please show me the research on tree rings in Australia, South America, Asia and Africa that will have full coverage of the regions. Even the BS tree ring study in Siberia cherry picked the trees that advanced the agenda and ignored the others. Reporting stations around the world cover hundreds of square miles as if temperature fluctuations don’t exist.

                      If you only utilize the items that advance your agenda, then you get the answer you want.

                    • And there were not surface temperature readings worldwide during the MWP. Considering HadCRUT uses a single oceanic temperature and a single reading in the Andes to project thousands of square miles, any information they have for the MWP is pretty bogus.

                    • Liar.. Liar.. Pants on fire.

                      “And there were not surface temperature readings worldwide during the MWP.” – Taxman

                      Nature has a full record of the regional warming known as the MWP.

                      You just can’t accept the reality.

                      Awwwwwwwwwwww.

                    • Liar. Liar… Pants on fire.

                      “Considering HadCRUT uses a single oceanic temperature and a single reading in the Andes to project thousands of square miles…”

                      And when your body temperature is measured orally or rectally do you think the measurement tells us anything about the absolute temperature of the tip of your nose, or the digits in your feet?

                      My goodness you are silly.

                    • Please review the temperature records. I will understand when the truth hurts, but for kool-aid drinkers like you, truth doesn’t matter if it opposes the absolutes you believe.

                    • “You have no realtime data to support MWP wasn’t global..” – Taxman

                      You want real time data collected now that measures glonal temperature in the MWP that occurred about 100 years ago?

                      My goodness you are stupid.

                    • I am not sure what “glonal” temperatures are. You were spouting that the MWP was not global without any proof. NONE. ZERO. NADA.

                    • And the hockey stick wasn’t real. I’ve seen the emails between England and the US. If the data in didn’t fit what they wanted the data out to be, they just changed the data input. GARBAGE IN GARBAGE OUT. It’s all the same anti capitalism idiots who dreamed up global cooling to scare the bejesus out of everybody decades ago. I hope you’re not stupid enough to fall for it.

                    • Which hockey stick? There are dozens of them now. All confirm each other, using different methods and data sets, and produced by different teams of scientists.

                    • Yes. I want your eyes. Pluck them out and send them to me.

                      The earth is now warmer than at any time in the last 120,000 years.

                    • Just change your input data. GARBAGE IN GARBAGE OUT. I can write you a program that will PROVE to you the climate is whatever you want it to be. You are nothing but a communist bot. NOW, what exactly would you like the climate to be today? Until you answer that question you are NOTHING BUT A FRAUD!

                    • IT’S THE SUN STUPID. And when the sun is quiescent, the earth cools. The earth warms again when sunspots erupt. THAT’S JUST THE WAY IT IS!

                    • Solar output is down, while the global average temperature of the earth hasn’t been higher in the last 120,000 years.

                      My goodness you are a silly little koot.

                    • WHAT DO YOU WANT THE CLIMATE TO BE? What should the TEMPERATURE be right here right now? PLEASE BE SPECIFIC. Else STFU!

                    • The “MWP was local” theory is a lie, plain and simple.

                      This paper found up to a 2 degree C warming in the Pacific and Antarctic oceans – which contradicts that “it was only Europe” claim:

                      http://www.sciencemag.org/content/342/6158/617

                      The short-lived “there was no MWP” claim was a desperate attempt by a few AGW guys to try and pretend they didn’t screw up the science. Again.

                    • Wrong!
                      wattsupwiththat.com/2013/10/31/new-paper-shows-medieval-warm-period-was-global-in-scope/

                      You have to keep up with the science.

                    • Standard response by people foolish enough to believe in Michael Mann’s Mann-made global warming. He had to wipe out major changes in climate to try to increase the threat. Nope the LIA and MWP were both world wide phenoms.

                    • Looks like all of the global temperature reconstructions agree with Michael Mann.

                      I bet that is because you aren’t very bright.

                    • How convenient to ignore the average earth temperature that has been in a plateau since 1997, and cherry picking a chart that is deceptive at best. So the earth’s temperature has nothing to do with the temperature over the water (90% of the surface of the earth) What a moron.

                    • You are stupid. The average of temperatures is NOT the average earth’s temperature. You are the biggest deceptive buffoon I have ever encountered. Have you ever spoken the truth in your life? Have you ever even bothered to find out the truth? Or is all you do is get paid to spread lies and deception? Paid by the special interests that make fortunes off of global warming hysteria. You know full well that from 1997 thru 2014 end, there has not been a higher average earth temperature yet you continue in your sick attempt to deceive people. You have no morals. You fit right in with the rest of the sick liberal progressive socialists that lie and deceive just like their leaders Obama and Clinton.

                    • As your chart so aptly points out, the average earth temperature for the past 17 years has remained unable to exceed the plateau. And you call me a liar? LOL. As of the end of 2015, idiots like you have been apoplectic about a statistically insignificant 2015 rise above the plateau. Really reaching for straws. You and all the rest of the alarmists remain dumb founded by that plateau since it went against all your mathematical predictions and computer models. None of you has yet to make anywhere near accurate predictions as to future events because as I have pointed out to you many times (and you continue to ignore the truth you lose on) science is not advanced enough to be able to understand climate change or predictions would be accurate. Again the truth you ignore of what science calls “the 100,000 year problem” shows proof positive that science admits they are not advanced enough in their understanding to be able to deal with that 100,000 year problem.

                      If you are never going to deal with the truth of the 100,000 problem and just pretend that reality does not exist, you should just take your pointless fantasy world of deception and just go away. I expect you will respond to this as you have in the past with your deceptive pointless dribble, avoiding the truth you lose on.

                    • I’m done with you. There are much more important things at stake . I’m sure you will be happily voting for Bernie Socialist or Hillary Criminal. The next President will end the EPA.

                    • Run away…. You Lying Scumbag…. Run away…..

                      President Hillary will be laughing at you. As I do now.

                    • I agree. In prehistoric times, the weather was much warmer on average. Maybe after the meteor hit, which is said to have caused the ice age, those temperatures from before is what the earth is suppose to be and we are working our way back to normal? We just do not know. We do not know what normal is. Everyone is only guessing.

                    • Derek confuses his own ignorance with science, and concludes that science is as ignorant as he is.

                      Well done Derek.

                    • We entered a thing called the Ice Age and things got colder. I was reading about the glaciers receding in Italy recently and them finding the remains of WW1 soldiers. So if the glaciers were formed after WW1 it means the temperature got colder. Now, it is getting back to normal.

                    • It is common knowledge among kooks that glaciers covered the entire northern hemisphere during and just after WW1.

                      You can see it recorded here in the following chart.

                    • So that means the warming up is because we are coming out of a cooling period? Is that what you are try to say. So global warming is not manmade?

                      I am more of an archaeologist. Reading history, I know there were periods that were warmer celibately than it is today.

                      What most people do not realize is in medieval times man also released carbon into the atmosphere. Instead of gas and oil heat, they burned wood which releases CO2 into the atmosphere.

                    • Is that England? I was talking about US. They probably are a few places that do go back further. But not on a world wide scale.

                      Tree rings show more of a growing season and whether it was optimal for a tree. It does not necessarily show the temperature.

                    • Those aren’t instrument records which is what all the “records” being set are all about. Those only go back 135 years of so.

                    • Tree rings only show how much sunshine and rain were in the area where the tree comes from. THAT IS CALLED WEATHER.

                    • This would give a better estimate of percipitation. And not daily records. We have estimates going back thousands of years The vikings in their travels wrote about weather and had a settlement on the east side of greenland which had to be abandoned because of weather.

                      There are plenty of things to point to warmer weather for years starting with the dinosaurs.

                      My belief global warming was created to control our lives by government.

                    • I read the emails between here and England. There is NO DOUBT they were changing input data to get the results they wanted. Now I’m not an investor in the climate exchange, but it’s pretty obvious that a LOT of people with a LOT of power are making a LOT of money from taxpayers with this nonsense. And they are the freaks who get LAWS passed so we have NO CHOICE but to PAY FOR IT ALL even though we know the truth of their fraud.

                    • All of the scientific investigations doubted it and concluded the exact opposite of what you have just claimed.

                      I understand that life on planet conservatard is everything you dream it to be.

                    • Tough. The climate has changed for millions of years. You cannot speed it up. You cannot slow it down. YOU ARE NOT MORE POWERFUL THAN GOD! Now, WHAT SHOULD THE IDEAL CLIMATE BE TODAY?

                    • “YOU ARE NOT MORE POWERFUL THAN GOD!” – NotherlandLJ

                      Your God is a fiction created by goat herders 4,.000 years ago.

                      Your God is dead. Science killed it.

                      Now get lost, Inferior.

                    • Jesus arose from the dead. Your global warming god is a gang of one world communist thugs. You give them all YOUR money if you want to as long as they keep their GREEDY, GRUBBY MITTS off of mine!

                    • That is 2,000 year old kook talk NorthlanderLT.

                      You have just proven that you don’t have the capacity to reason logically.

                      Ahahahahahahahah……

                    • I was a computer programmer/systems analyst/systems administrator for decades, proving every day that I am a very logical person. You, on the other hand, have proven to be a communist bot.

                    • Please learn to read. I just told you I was a programmer and before that I was a computer operator. Now how do you think the world warmed and cooled for millions of years without your communist nonsense? And why do you presume that the same thing that was supposed to cure global cooling is supposed to cure global warming. ANSWER TO BOTH IS GOVERNMENT CONTROL AFTER SHUTTING DOWN ALL INDUSTRY. CURE TO EVERYTHING IS COMMUNISM IN YOUR EYES. Problem is, communism does not work. Never has. Never will.

                    • Sorry child. But writing scripts in pearl doesn’t make you a programmer.

                      It makes you a janitor.

                      Ahahahahahahahahahahahah………..

                    • I prefer COBOL, but you can wright in piglatin for all I care. YOU CAN’T CHANGE THE CLIMATE no matter how much communist nonsense you have in your head. You are nothing but a communist bot.

                    • COBOL. Oh my goodness. You are very OOOOOOOOOOOOOld. as well as very stuuuuuuuuuuupid.

                      Alzheimers perhaps.

                    • Not to worry. I spent many years doing conversions to any language you like. You on the other hand are nothing but an obnoxious little communist punk. You will thank me for fighting for you when you get out of your mommy’s basement and try to earn a living.

                    • Your a vet too? That makes you triple the scum bag you were earlier.

                      Real men refuse to go to war to protect bankers and stock brokers.

                      But I see that you weren’t brave or smart enough to do that.

                      Ahahahahahahh Truly inferior… Ahahahahahahah…..

                    • Pssst: I’m smart enough to USE banks and stock brokers to my advantage. When you learn something about the economy you will understand. Meanwhile, GO GET AN EDUCATION.

                    • You have no science. All you have are computer models from government paid communist idiots. And you’re dumb enough to believe it? GARBAGE IN GARBAGE OUT! LOL.

                    • And who calibrated your thermometers 120,000 years ago? You have NOTHING. Computer models your communist thugs tell you prove something. I can make you feel much better if you want a computer model that will prove to you how misguided you are. But I suspect you’d rather let the communist thieves keep sucking money out of your pockets to solve a problem that DOES NOT EXIST. LOL.

                    • “And who calibrated your thermometers 120,000 years ago?” – NorthlanderLJ Kook

                      Your God did of course.

                      He did it by arranging for the proportion of C14 and O18 to change as it is irradiated in the upper atmosphere. And arranging for the uptake of O18 and C14 in shells formed in shallow waters to change in response to the temperature of the water in which crystals of calcium Carbonate form, thereby allowing the growth rate and the growth temperature to be measured.

                      Your God placed all kinds of thermometers all over the planet. And all show that the planet is warming.

                      My goodness you are an idiot for denying them.

                    • “Computer models your communist thugs tell you prove something.” – NorthlanderLJ

                      I’m sorry, but you are beginning to speak in tongues rather than English.

                      I understand that kookie Christians do that kind of thing when the spirit moves them.

                      Meanwhile we Scientists have data. Sun’s output down. Global Temperatures higher now than at any time in the last 120,000 years.

                    • “But I suspect you’d rather let the communist thieves keep sucking money out of your pockets ” – NorthlanderLJ Kook.

                      You are right. Global Warming can’t be happening because your taxes are too high.

                      Lol Lol Lol Lol Lol Lol…..

                      Meanwhile. Back here on planet reality… Even the satellite record shows warming.

                    • Liar.. Liar.. Pants on fire.

                      “YOU CAN’T CHANGE THE CLIMATE no matter how much communist nonsense you have in your head.” – NorthLanderLJ Kook

                      Man has changed the climate. Hence your statement is a lie.

                      Koooooooooook.

                      Even the satellites show it.

                    • Satellites show nothing of the kind. THE EARTH WARMS, THE EARTH COOLS. You can’t speed it up, and you can’t slow it down. NOW WHAT EXACTLY WOULD YOU LIKE THE CLIMATE ON EARTH TO BE TODAY?

                    • And overall the earth is most certainly warming. And doing so right along computed lines.

                      Ahahahahahahahha…. You pathetic loser.

                    • And the earth is about to enter a cooling period. The sun is in a quiescent period. THAT’S JUST THE WAY IT IS. You want a computer model to PROVE IT? I can make one up for you if it will make you feel better. LOL.

                    • “The sun is in a quiescent period.” – NorthlanderLJ Kook

                      And the earth has never been warmer in the last 120,000 years.

                      It looks like you don’t know that the word “cooling” means. Have you run out of tinfoil for your hats?

                    • Watch and learn. By the way, what was used to measure the climate 120,000 years ago. Let’s see, that might be .000000000000000000001% of the millions of years since the earth was created. Now WHAT YEAR was the climate JUST RIGHT for you? LOL.

                    • Computers can’t be made to fail. If they run for more than 4.5 billion clock cycles then there is nothing man can do to corrupt their opreation. – NorthlanderLJ Kook

                    • “Now how do you think the world warmed and cooled for millions of years without your communist nonsense?” – NorthLanderLJ

                      How doe you think people died for millions of years without guns?

                      Guns can’t kill people. It must be nature.

                      Janitor logic.

                    • People kill people. Go explain that to the people in Chicago. What do guns have to do with the climate?

                    • People can’t kill people, because nature has always killed people, so you can’t say that nature didn’t do it.

                      Your Janitor Logic at work.

                      Ahahahahahahahahahahah……….

                    • So you think people just DROP DEAD when their climate doesn’t meet your ideal. Now WHAT EXACTLY IS YOUR IDEAL CLIMATE? LOL.

                    • “ANSWER TO BOTH IS GOVERNMENT CONTROL AFTER SHUTTING DOWN ALL INDUSTRY.” – NorthlanderLJ Kook

                      Ya, and I remember when you fear mongering Republican Kooks were claiming that the Montreal Protocol to reduce CFC emissions was going to kill 3 billion people.

                      Ahahahahahahahah…. My goodness you are mentally ill.

                    • “keep their GREEDY, GRUBBY MITTS off of mine!” – NorthLanderLT

                      Translation: Global Warming can’t be happening because my taxes are too high.

                      Ahahahahahahah…. Koooooooooooooook

                    • If you want to pay a fortune to heat your house and pay your light bill, go ahead and believe the communist lies on the climate. Go shut down coal mines, shut down oil drilling, shut down power plants and live with your candles to light the night. Just don’t expect me to believe your communist lies. You are a communist bot. Totally full of it.

                    • “Go shut down coal mines, shut down oil drilling, shut down power plants” – NorthlanderLJ

                      We are doing exactly that. And you – a coward – is cowering in your boots, and soiling yourself in protest.

                      You are ruled by fear and a world view that comes from 4,000 years ago.

                      That is why I laugh at you, and those inferiors like you.

                    • Keep laughing for one year. America is about to vote all you communist pukes OUT! Do whatever you please for the next year. WE’LL SURVIVE. WE ARE AMERICANS! You’re outta there in a year!

                    • Hahahahahahahaha…..

                      You also are a Trump Chump I see.

                      Ahahahahahahahahah…..

                      None of the Republican Extremists that are riding in the Republican Clown Car have any chance of winning in the coming federal election.

                      Not even normal Republicans can stomach them.

                      It will be fun watching your head explode in the next few months.

                      Ahhahahahahahahahahahah……..

                    • Have fun. You have ONE YEAR. And you can’t change any laws. All you can do is issue temporary king’s orders. Problem for you, your little king wanna be is NOT a king. His word lasts until he is GONE, which will be soon. And by the way, Trump isn’t the only guy who can WIN!

                    • Hohohohohohoho…. Nothing in the Republican clown car can win. That is why the Republican party is desperately looking for alternatives.

                      Even they know it is hopeless.

                      But not youd boy. Kausen yood be smarted and averyfink.

                      Ahahahahahahahahahahahah…

                    • OK. You have the insults down pat. Now USE YOUR HEAD! Then write some darn thing that makes some kind of sense. Every one of the republicans in this race will BEAT YOUR CANDIDATE LIKE A WORTHLESS DRUM. Deal with it!

                    • “Every one of the republicans in this race will BEAT YOUR CANDIDATE LIKE A WORTHLESS DRUM” – NorthLanderLG

                      Hmmm you remind me of someone…

                      Who could that be…

                    • I get a kick every time when I see you Republican Retards proclaiming Obama to be a do nothing dictator.

                      Ahahahahahahahah…

                    • Not a dictator. But you Republicans have spent the last 7 years claiming that he was.

                      Make up your minds, Kook Farts.

                    • Throwing out insults does NOT make you look like you have a brain. It PROVES you have NO argument. The kenyan just WANTS TO BE A DICTATOR. We’ve spent 7 years laughing at his frustration. LOL.

                    • There are no people more worthy of insult that people like you – the willfully ignorant.

                      “The kenyan just WANTS TO BE A DICTATOR.” -NorthlanderJK Kook

                      Liar, Liar.. Pants on fire.

                      But he does want to avoid a do nothing Republican congress full of people who are willfully ignorant.

                      And you are a Trump Chump too. Ahahahahahahah…. Your life is just one spectacular fail.

                    • ” WE’LL SURVIVE. WE ARE AMERICANS!” – NorthLanderLJ Kook

                      Only by deporting uneducated denialist kooks like you who are the core purveyors of treason in your country.

                    • Too bad for you. I’M AN AMERICAN. THIS IS MY COUNTRY. AND AMERICANS GET TO DECIDE WHO COMES TO OUR COUNTRY! If we don’t want them here THEY GOTTA GO!

                    • When do you intend to remove this poem from the statue of Liberty?

                      Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
                      With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
                      Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
                      A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
                      Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
                      Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
                      Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
                      The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.

                      “Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries she
                      With silent lips. “Give me your tired, your poor,
                      Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
                      The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
                      Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
                      I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

                      Looks like a lot of melting (red) in Greenland.

                    • That poem has nothing to do with American law. It became obsolete when we started paying welfare to Americans and the courts ordered the same payments to every invader that made its way into this nation.

                    • So the poem that so many Americans have quoted and been proud of all these years was all just a lie.

                      Just like everything else in America.

                    • Benjamin Franklin knows your kind.

                      You are savages and unworthy of existing in America.

                      “All Property, indeed, except the Savage’s temporary Cabin, his Bow, his Matchcoat, and other little Acquisitions, absolutely necessary for his Subsistence, seems to me to be the Creature of public Convention. Hence the Public has the Right of Regulating Descents, and all other Conveyances of Property, and even of limiting the Quantity and the Uses of it. All the Property that is necessary to a Man, for the Conservation of the Individual and the Propagation of the Species, is his natural Right, which none can justly deprive him of: But all Property superfluous to such purposes is the Property of the Publick, who, by their Laws, have created it, and who may therefore by other Laws dispose of it, whenever the Welfare of the Publick shall demand such Disposition. He that does not like civil Society on these Terms, let him retire and live among Savages. He can have no right to the benefits of Society, who will not pay his Club towards the Support of it.” – Benjamin Franklin to Robert Morris

                    • OOOO. Greenland is melting. NOW HOW IN SAM HILL DO YOU SUPPOSE IT FROZE OVER. They are finding mining tools proving that the climate was once WARM ENOUGH for people to live and work there. And by the way, how do you suppose it got the name GREENLAND? LOL.

                    • “NOW HOW IN SAM HILL DO YOU SUPPOSE IT FROZE OVER” – NorthlanderLJ

                      I thing your God did it to keep a cold ice cap on top the entry to hell to prevent Lucifer from escaping.

                      Bahahahahahahahahahahahah……….. No,… it was the moon God that did it.

                      No, it was Ganesh. Odin, No. No. The Great Profit Zahrquahn did it.

                      People living on Greenland? Impossible, unless you ignore history.

                      Ahahahahahah… Kooooooooooooook.

                    • IT’S THE SUN STUPID. That is why we’re finding mining tools from the people who used to live and work there. In fact Minnesota where I live was covered with icebergs that came through here a few million years ago. That is where the prairies came from. Icebergs flattened the land. I guess the prehistoric animals forgot to change their light bulbs. LOL.

                    • Solar output is down, Earth’s temperature is up.

                      Sorry Boy. But you are mentally ill. You should see a psychiatrist before you start smearing your own dung on yourself.

                    • Yes. All climatologists are secretly plotting to take over the world. I sawed its on the intertubes.

                      Kooooooooook.

                    • Yes. All climatologists are secretly plotting to take over the world. I sawed its on the intertubes.

                      Kooooooooook.

                    • Yes. All climatologists are secretly plotting to take over the world. I sawed its on the intertubes.

                      Kooooooooook.

                    • Satellites don’t measure ground temperatures.

                      In fact they mostly see clouds when they look down.

                      Ahahahahah… You are a silly little kook.

                    • Satellites don’t measure ground temperatures.

                      In fact they mostly see clouds when they look down.

                      Ahahahahah… You are a silly little kook.

                  • Earth based measurements directly measure ground level temperatures.

                    Satellite based measurements struggle to measure the temperature of a 10 km thick layer with a median height of 4 kilometers.

                    No thinking person expects them to be the same.

                    But Big Kitty Does.

                    Ahahahahahahahahahah……………

                • Not to mention the Vikings, who had fishing villages and raised barley in parts of coastal Greenland that are, today, Arctic tundra.

                  Going back further, the Romans had vineyards and made wine in England at one time.

                  The list goes on and on. Don’t forget the Pleistocene Ice Age, which was actually a series of dozens of glacial advances and retreats. Between them, there were times when there was less ice than today, and the climate was undoubtedly warmer. In fact, the Ice Age is still going on. We just happen to be between glaciation events. Lucky for us. It was chilly, not long ago. But those glacial periods were an eyeblink ago in geologic time.

                  As recently as a thousand years ago the American Midwest had a climate similar to that of today’s Mojave desert.

                  The climate changes all the time. Sometimes drastically, and quickly. Never conveniently. The global climate is, and has always been, unstable.

                • Our Lord has a great sense of humor. When they were howling about global cooling, the earth warmed. When they were howling about global warming, the earth cooled. Now they’re howling about CLIMATE CHANGE but they can’t tell you EXACTLY what the climate SHOULD be. LOL.

              • The title, in and of itself, is a farce. “Earth’s Warmest Month on Record” How long has man been recording and compiling temperature around the globe? Twenty years? Thirty? In all reality, I doubt it’s been that long.

                • Soil samples and tree growth also function as a measure of temperature. There are various geologic and biological processes that can reflect temperature accurately back a couple hundred years. So, we haven’t been keeping track, but the planet has.

                  • Trees are not an accurate measurement of temperature. Dendroclimatology is an evolving science in and of itself. The only accurate way of measuring temperature is by direct measurement using a device that measures temperature. All other methods are just estimations.

                    • “All measurements are just estimations.”

                      So how do you explain that we are measuring global temperature to hundreds of a degree? And alarmists keep telling us each year is the warmest ever recorded?

                    • Each years average anomaly is computed to two significant figures, but with two sigma error bars that are much wider. These generally aren’t provided because American are too stupid to understand simple averages, and would be completely lost with a confidence limit.

                      Errors in the global temperature anomaly for the last couple of decades have been in the 0.05’C range.

                      We continue to see “warmest year ever recorded” because the earth is warming, and for the last few years every year has been warmer than the last.

                    • So speaks the arrogant intellectual elite who believes we are harming the earth with a faith akin to a child’s belief in Santa Claus. You Believers are so desperate to “matter”, but you are not only unimportant, you are destructive to man’s legitimate search for knowledge. Look up “Lysenkoism”. That is what you have done to government-funded science.

                    • Liar, liar, pants on fire! Even the RAW data has been cooked, so to speak. For example, it isn’t following any scientific methodology to estimate an area’s temperature by arbitrarily assigning it the HIGHEST temperature from all of the closest weather station instruments. Likewise, if a given weather station quits, the temperature assigned is the highest of other stations nearest to its location. And how are the locations decided upon? Are they just placed close to the

                    • Sorry, but it’s not done that way.

                      When a station’s measurements do not meet data quality tests then it is replaced by an interpolated value obtained from sites around it that are adjusted to accommodate the average difference in readings from those sites.

                      You really should stop lying about how the data is processed.

                      Now, if you don’t like that method, you can head over the the BEST climate reconstruction where no adjustments are made to the data at all.

                      Kooooooooooook.

                    • You said, “When a station’s measurements do not meet data quality tests then it is
                      replaced by an interpolated value obtained from sites around it that are
                      adjusted to accommodate the average difference in readings from those
                      sites.” In other words, a guess, NOT a measurement! Why don’t you Believers just “interpolate” ALL your data?
                      http://www.climate-skeptic.com/temperature_measurement/

                      http://www.naturalnews.com/045695_global_warming_fabricated_data_scientific_fraud.html

                      Here is an interesting list of Climate myths that you probably believe in:

                      https://usnewsghost.wordpress.com/2014/04/01/ipcc-falsifying-climate-change-science-fraud-reports-exposed-co2-global-warming-recent/

                    • “Errors in the global temperature anomaly for the last couple of decades have been in the 0.05’C range.”

                      If you believe that you are either really gullible or a complete ideologue. We used to monitor 6000 land stations to get our temperature data. We rolled that back to 1500. And most of the stations removed were rural (read that cooler) stations. This gave alarmists another opportunity to adjust temperatures. In the oceans we need roughly 1,000,000 as many probes as we currently have. The ocean controls much more heat than the atmosphere does, but in the last 60 years using the data we have the temperature of the ocean has increase one tenth of a degree. The missing heat is not in the ocean no matter what Karl’s study said. Our ability to actually measure the temperature is shaky and then to average it for the entire planet is ludicrous. And if you follow the temperatures almost all of the heating on your graph has occurred where we have the fewest stations that is the arctic.

                    • Basically true but ancient rings can be compared to recent tree rings to draw comparisons. Ice cores show pollen and that correlates to climate. True that isn’t temperature data but again correlates.

                    • If that is true, why did we need Mike’s nature trick to make his hockey stick. And you see things like that all the time on AGW problems. You can’t find a hot spot with temperature data so you dismiss millions of measurements and go to wind speed and translate that (another opportunity to add do mischief) to find a slight warming. This is the reason anyone who isn’t in the climate change area dependent upon grants from government that is looking for consensus, isn’t that taken in by the massive gyrations this massive consensus undergoes.

                  • Not really. It depends on a lot of variables which frequently we don’t know all about. For instance is tree growth a function of heat or moisture or both? And doesn’t that differ among the type of tree it is? It’s better than nothing, but when you have Mike ‘s nature trick thrown in it makes looking back about as reliable as the thermometers are with the adjustments GISS and the other make to their data.

                    • Ya, there is a lot of variation but averaging takes care of most of that.

                      And if you don’t like tree rings then there are shell growth rings, and coral growth rings, also the crystal morphology of corals, direct borehole temperature measurements, and O16 to O18 isotope levels, changes in the terminus of plant and animal ranges, etc. etc. etc.

                      Chinese observations of climate go back 2,000 years.

                    • I’m pretty sure the Chinese can’t give us the temperature in degrees F or C or K or anything else for that matter. Observations are good and they tell us about the MWP and the LIA, but the alarmists tell us they were local events and didn’t really happen worldwide. It screws up Mann’s hockey stick and make the little warming we’ve experience something that we should be saying so what about.

                    • The Chinese records hold the dates of first frost, first snow, first date of a frozen lake, etc, date of the first blossoms, etc.

                    • Fear not. Vendi will either never post on this thread again or will call names and post meaningless drivel “proving” I’m wrong. Either way his faith as a Believer is unshakable. Hopefully he is one of a vanishing breed….

                    • No they’re not. Chinese are buying our cheap, dirty coal by the SHIPLOAD. Are you a BOT? Or are you just crazy in the head?

                    • There are no denialist morons anywhere unless you consider the alarmists who see no statisically significant warming in the past 18 years but who deny that–denialist morons. Oh, wait a minute, that would include you. I know they are the biggest CO2 polluters on earth, but somehow they are considered heroes by the alarmists because they promise sometime 15 years from now they we cap their CO2 levels—but first we have found out they’ve been lying about the amount they are currently creating by underestimating it by 17%. Yeah, there are no denialist morons in the chinese government, but the alarmist are full of denialists morons regarding the Chinese.

                    • Yes. Tree rings in a sunny, rainy Georgia year may show one thing while tree rings in a drought torn area of Africa may show the opposite IN THE SAME YEAR!

                  • Tree rings have nothing to do with anything unless every tree on earth has the same tree ring changes for a period of time… WHICH THEY DON’T. Fat tree rings in Africa just means they had a lot of sun and rain that year.

                    • Most areas were the records were kept were cities. With the advent of sky scrapers and the automobile, during the winters city would go up a degree or 2 because of all the people opening doors. And these warm building would transfer some of their hear out.

                    • This would bias the temperature record higher the farther back in time you go and hence would reduce the observed rate of warming.

                      You are demolishing your own argument.

                    • No. I don’t mean millions. Temperature records aren’t going to go back much further than the evolution of land dwelling plants and animals.

                    • Land dwelling plants and animals developed only once on this planet.

                      So your question of “what period” is just stupid.

                    • Stupid people don’t believe God created the universe. Their minds were perverted to “evolution of land dwelling plants and animals.” With their perversion, the global warming/climate change was invented. Sad life.

                    • LOL. You think land animals are less than a million years old? Really???? I mean really???? I thought you were an ideologue, but I didn’t think you were that stupid.

                  • From what consistent location, temperatures vary by elevation, time of day, clouds, urban vs rural, deforestatation, solar flares, el ninas, storm fronts, etc., etc.?

                    All I know is we have not flooded like all gore predicted we did, lol.

                    My favorite laugh was when the global truthers blamed bush for the hurricanes.

                    Can people really be that dumb?

                    Yep!

                    • You are only partially correct. In 2006, he said Manhattan would be completely flooded in 15 years.

                      Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!!!!!!!!!!

                    • Liar… Liar.. Pants on fire.

                      Gore said no such thing.

                      Why do you insist on lying?

                      Are you mentally ill?

                    • In 2006, on NBC’s Today Show, former-Vice President Al Gore predicted that Manhattan would be flooded in “15 to 20 years.” He added, “In fact the World Trade Center Memorial site would be underwater.”

                      Ha, ha, ha,ha,ha,ha!!!!!!!

                      The cult religion of global warming, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!!!!!!!!!!

                    • Gore did predict all kinds of calamities and none have occurred. No more snow in the Northeast. Stronger and more frequent hurricanes. Need I go on because I can if you don’t remember or you don’t know how to do your own research.

                    • In 2006, on NBC’s Today Show, former-Vice President Al Gore predicted that Manhattan would be flooded in “15 to 20 years.” He added, “In fact the World Trade Center Memorial site would be underwater.”

                    • My biggest laugh when Bush said “well done Brownie” to his incompetent point man in Louisiana.

                      It was almost as funny as Bush’s brother selling pumps that didn’t work to that city.

                      And even funnier when Bush denied cutting funding to levee improvements two years earlier claiming that they were unnecessary.

                      And even funnier than Bush claiming “No one ever anticipated that the levees would be breached.”

                      Republican incompetence knows no bounds.

                    • Everybody knew that New Orleans is a punchbowl next to and below sea level and that it was going to be hit with a hurricane sooner or later years before 2005. In fact the Bush administration called for evacuations 3 days before the actual damage hit. The real failure was on the chocolate city Dipshitocrat losers running New Orleans at the time and their ineptitude.
                      FEMA under Homeland Security was only a compounded failure caused by the stupidity of making the solution to the failure of several government bureaucracies on 9/11 and making them all part of one large government bureaucracy.

                      None of which has the slightest thing to do with your climate hoax. Copy there, Chicken Little?

                    • Like Obama and his 57 states?

                      Or his two minute pause when he stumbled like an idiot when the teleprompter malfunctioned?

                      Or how about when idiot Obama just this past week said Isis had been contained just hours before Isis terrorized Paris…

                      Meanwhile aloof am gore kept broadcasting global warming scares from the eiffle tower.

                      You’re so f___king unhinged everybody with a brain is laughing at you nitwits.

                      How many inches of flooding does Manhattan have in the last 10 years from global warming like al gore promised?

                  • In the matter of real science data is collected under very strict protocols… Even today the data being collected around the globe hardly follows that standard I.e, the hockeystick was/is Prue fabrication and scientific hogwash

                    • I think only a dozen you would like to present..By the time of the second IPCC report in 1995 where for the first time CO2 forcing began to be proposed more prominently as a cause of serious alarm, the Medieval Warm Period was sidelined in the text and narrative. An important way that this was done in the report was to alter the diagram of recent climate history by simply shortening the time period it covered so that it now started after the Medieval Warm Period. All that was shown was the long slow recovery from the Little Ice Age to today’s temperatures, i.e. a long period of increasing temperatures. But clearly this was only a short term solution. The way that the Medieval Warm Period dominated the recent climate graph challenged the basic argument for CO2 forcing which was that the late 20th century climate was some how unique. As Jay Overpeck, an IPCC participant said in his email to Professor Deming, “We have to get rid of the Medieval Warm Period”.

                  • None of those are as accurate as they want us to believe, and there has been plenty of evidence that even still, the “scientists” have modified the data. They are making predictions in the tenth of degrees and I can guarantee you that a measurement in the 1800s were not that accurate, and reading natures records even less so. Not to mention that they are making predictions using computer
                    algorithms that have not been accurate in the short term let alone trustworthy for long term estimates. Mix in the political emphasis, and you can’t trust anything they say.

              • I remember when the libtards tried to scare us back in the mid 1970s with the return of the ice age and global cooling.

                Are you al gores bastard son from a prostitute, or just another deranged lunatic lefty?

              • So what, when you cook the data, to get the results you want it isn’t science.
                It sure will be funny when all you lemmings wake up to the fact that the UN is just trying to get your money, and seize power from your National Government, and give your taxes to Ethiopia.
                Here’s a counter argument to your link.
                SCM_RC_2015_08_24_EN.pdf

                  • To be clear, I am undecided on the matter of global warning. There is insufficient verifiable evidence that it is happening, or that it isn’t happening, that hasn’t been proven to be horribly stilted or subjected to bias. I’m approaching the issue as statistician.
                    Either they have been for to accepting of questionable data, or they are readily pushing the same lie.

                  • Any denial is from you alarmists who deny that the most powerful naturally occurring climate forcing event of the glacial cool down and inter-glacial warm up that over powers the 40,000 year orbital cycle has anything to do with the normal highs we will see in about 800 years. You call this the “100,000 year problem” and totally ignore it because it proves all your alarmist theories are lies and deceptions.

              • Once again, an anomaly. While attempting to justify human guilt for a global governing body, for BANKS and the political hacks.
                How’s the Carbon extortion racket going? Hit the trillion mark yet today?

                Oh, your not supposed to tell the useful idiots, wink, wink.
                I got your back buddy, not another word!

              • By one measure. By others it was cooler. You can “prove” anything by cherry-picking the data.

                The Earth is billions of years old. The methods used to measure “global temperature” have only been around for a few years. None of the “records” are meaningful.

                • Actually the Dome Fuji ice core samples show the record quite nicely. In fact current temperatures are still 2 to 4 degrees cooler than the normal naturally occurring inter-glacial warm ups of the past 500,000 years according to the black temperature line on this NOAA graph… Even at the recent extremely rapid temperature rise of 1/2 degree centigrade over about 1200 years, it would take 400 to 800 years to reach those normal highs.
                  http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/abrupt/data2.html

                • .❝my neighbor’s mom is making $98 HOURLY on the internet❞….A few days ago new McLaren F1 subsequent after earning 18,512$,,,this was my previous month’s paycheck ,and-a little over, $17k Last month ..3-5 h/r of work a day ..with extra open doors & weekly paychecks.. it’s realy the easiest work I have ever Do.. I Joined This 7 months ago and now making over $87, p/h..Learn More right Here….
                  4naj…..
                  ➤➤
                  ➤➤➤ http://GlobalSuperEmploymentVacanciesReportReal/GetPaid/$97hourly… ❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦

                • I got a BS (Bull $hit) degree in science then added an MS (More $hit) in the same subject. But when I went out for the PhD (Piled Higher and Deeper) I realized I would have to narrow my focus to such a fine detail that I would become useless. So I bailed. Thank God for random favors.

                  • .❝my neighbor’s mom is making $98 HOURLY on the internet❞….A few days ago new McLaren F1 subsequent after earning 18,512$,,,this was my previous month’s paycheck ,and-a little over, $17k Last month ..3-5 h/r of work a day ..with extra open doors & weekly paychecks.. it’s realy the easiest work I have ever Do.. I Joined This 7 months ago and now making over $87, p/h..Learn More right Here….
                    bf…….
                    ➤➤
                    ➤➤➤ http://GlobalSuperEmploymentVacanciesReportJobs/GetPaid/$97hourly… ❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦.❦

              • Of course NOAA is not using RSS. RSS isn’t taken seriously and it doesn’t measure surface temperatures.

                At best, RSS measures the average temperature of the lower troposphere, at a median altitude of around 4 kilometers.

                Have you ever been 4 Kilometers up? It’s cold up there.

                    • The planet is becoming more urbanized by the minute. Of course surface temperatures are going to be higher than they were 100 years ago. Cities are basically large heat sinks. If anything we have an overpopulation problem which demands immediate action and in the spirit of urgency I suggest you, Vendicar, do the honorable thing and starve yourself to death.

                    • And when the cities are removed from the data set, the surface temperature record shows even more warming.

                      My goodness you are an ignorant loser.

                    • Liar Liar.. Pants on Fire.

                      Man is responsible for 100% of the excess CO2 that has accumulated in the atmosphere and which has nearly doubled the Atmospheric concentration of CO2.

                      You are confusing CO2 flux with CO2 accumulation. How silly of you.

                    • I am not confusing a thing. You are introducing a concept of additional accumulation that fits your deception. Truth is 96% of ALL CO2 given off is natural. Man is responsible for 4%. That accumulation is occurring can be attributed PERHAPS to man but that has no impact on temperature in the scheme of things. It is the normal glacial cycle, that 100,000 year problem, which is the most powerful naturally occurring climate forcing event which science alarmists ignore, that is controlling climate change (a natural phenomena by the way) NOT man. Man cannot control weather, man cannot control earth quake. Man cannot control climate change… only in the mind of alarmists and those that want grant money.

                    • I’m not confusing anything. 96% of all CO2 in the atmosphere is from natural sources. 4% is from man. The temperatures are what always occur at the end of EVERY inter-glacial warm up. You alarmists deny this FACT. Then you wonder why all your projections and computer models are WRONG! And all you can do is continue to deny and fear monger.

                    • Confused old man. – “96% of all of the CO2 in the atospere is from natural sources.”

                      Pre-industrial CO2 levels were 270 PPMV. Current levels are 400 PPMV. The difference 130 PPMV is entirely from anthropogenic emissions.

                    • The effect of doubling is half as much as the previous doubling. Thus from from 100 to 200 was half of the previous from 50 to 100. Then from 200 to 400 was half again. So the reality of going from 200 to 1600 would be still less than going from 100 to 200. And every additional doubling is virtually totally ineffective.

                      What you and all the other deceptive alarmists ignore (because it destroys your lies and deceptions) is the FACT that the glacial cycle is what controls climate change. Science is not advanced enough to understand it so they ignore it. They call it the 100,000 year problem.
                      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100,000-year_problem

                    • “The effect of doubling is half as much as the previous doubling.” – Old Man

                      Claptrap.

                      The curve is log, but you are childishly presuming that the halving concentration is 400 ppmv. Your choice is arbitrary and false.

                      The curve actually looks as follows.

                      The effect of doubling is half as much as the previous doubling – PNAS. Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A. 2009 Feb 10; 106(6): 1704–1709.

                    • LOL! You have proved nothing to refute that the effect is halved. You cannot because it is. The data used by the warming alarmists is flawed. PROOF is that all their predictions are proven false by the REAL data that does not happen as they predict. The reason is simple. They have no idea why the 100,000 problem does what it does. When science advances enough so they understand, then they can incorporate that into their data for accurate predictions. Until then the charts and predictions for the future will, AS IN THE PAST, all prove false again. Let me know when some predictions actually are proven by the actual data. Until then you are just fear mongering on speculation with no predictions that have ever been correct. Denier.

                    • “the glacial cycle is what controls climate change.” – Old Man

                      New quackery from the Denialist camp. Last week you turds were claiming it was all due to the sun.

                      Make up your mind WhackTards.

                    • You are the “Whack Tard” in denial. Have you even bothered to look at the NOAA web site I have posted for you many times? I’m sure you have and know it is correct but ignore the 100,000 year problem whose wiki link I have also provided you. Denial is your badge, I totally accept climate change that has been around in its present form for over 1 million years. Caused by the most powerful naturally occurring climate forcing event of the glacial cooling – interglacial warming cycle that is not understood by scientists so the call it the 100,000 year problem. Your mud slinging and name calling to avoid the issue you lose on only shows just that ; You are a loser.

                    • At least you are consistent in denying the most powerful naturally occurring climate forcing event that has caused global warming, identical to today, without man’s added CO2. Keep denying as all your predictions continue to fail. I predict that the warm up will continue just as it has for a million years due to the 100,000 year problem you ignore. When you can disprove that the 100,000 year problem does not exist, which you cannot because it is real, or can understand why it does what it does, then I will give your then corrected science credence. Until then, it is politically motivated BS

                    • “Science is not advanced enough to understand it so they ignore it.” – Old Man

                      But you are advanced enough. Ahahahahahahahahahah…
                      Oh my Gawad that is laughable…….

                    • Then tell me genius, why do they ignore it and call it the 100,000 year problem. THEY DO NOT UNDERSTAND IT! Maybe you think science will never advance more than it is today. You lose on the issue so you try to make a joke of it but only succeed in showing your own stupidity.

                    • You are a joke.
                      I do not pretend to understand it but I know not to ignore it for political reasons. I know that the past 1 million years have been controlled by it. I know that the current warm up is identical to the past interglacial warm ups that you ignore, when there was no man around emitting CO2. To believe that the same temperature increases of that had nothing to do with CO2 are now being controlled by CO2… IS STUPID! The warm up, caused by the 100,000 year problem that is being ignored as eccentric, is being attributed falsely to CO2 which is why all the predictions continue to fail and will continue to fail based on flawed data that does not include the 100,000 year problem… BECAUSE THEY DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHY it has controlled climate change for 1 million years. DUH.

                    • “I do not pretend to understand it but I know not to ignore it for political reasons.” – StephenVW

                      In other words you admit that you are ignorant but object to reality for political reasons.

                      People are best advised to ignore the ignorant political ramblings of clueless old men.

                    • You speak of reality but ignore the 100,000 year problem which is absolutely reality. The most powerful naturally occurring climate forcing event doing what it has always done… yet you would have us believe that this time man is causing it. You are not just stupid, you think everyone else is as stupid as you are and will believe your deception and ignoring of the truth.

                    • The 100.000 year problem is a problem with your memory and thinking ability.

                      No doubt you imagineered it during one of your communion sessions with Big Foot.

                    • “I know that the current warm up is identical to the past interglacial warm ups that you ignore” – Vapid Old man.

                      You poor Retard. As you have been repeatedly told, global temperatures have been cooling for the last 10,000 years. Until recently.

                      As the following graphic shows. The current warming is unprecedented. Temperatures are now higher than at any time in the last 120,000 years.

                    • Hello???? Why do you act as if I have not already addressed this stupid chart and statement? Oh… thats right… the liberal progressive socialist method of the 1930’s … If you repeat a lie once it is just a lie. If you repeat it enough times… it becomes the truth.

                    • You are sick. To continue to ignore the truth that you lose on, issue deception and ad homonym attacks. Sick.

                    • Your hockey stick chart has been debunked for its false unscientific creation. As can be seen in the chart below, your assertion is a lie. This peer reviewed chart shows your deception. Your chart is in the far right yellow shaded area. You continue to prove that your agenda is lies and deception and refusal to address the truth. You attempt to avoid the truth that you lose on with your sick childish ad homonym attacks. Loser.

                      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/f9fabfc6ac119e97f312ef8e81b0506ee683c6467606522130f56f0eb36df0aa.gif

                    • “The warm up, caused by the 100,000 year problem” – Vapid Old Koot

                      Have you been checked for Alzheimers?

                    • You do realize that the black line in the chart is an average of about a dozen estamated temperatures based on a multitude of regional written stories of isolated weather events from 10,000 years ago thru present as well as regional estimates of temperatures from other sources – all of which disagree – but which create a nicely deceptive average for your stupid disproved hockey stick .

                    • Well, we are making progress. You admit you are deceptive and I am correct but your ad homynum attacks are your only weapon since you lose on the truth. Sick person.

                    • “Science is not advanced enough to understand it so they ignore it.” – Old Man

                      But you are advanced enough. Ahahahahahahahahahah…
                      Oh my Gawad that is laughable…….

                    • First that does not contradict the fact that 96% of all CO2 emissions are natural and only 4% are from man. So who is confused?
                      Second due to the halving effect, that 130 ppmv increase has a minimal effect on average earth temperatures.
                      Third Average earth temperatures are progressing as they have for millions of years without any man input and are still 3 degrees cooler then the past natural high temperatures. So what is the problem??? There is none. Temperatures are progressing normally as they always have for millions of years. I can’t wait for a mile deep glacier over Washington D.C. to freeze government spending.

                    • Liar… Liar… Pants on fire…

                      “The temperatures are what always occur at the end of EVERY inter-glacial warm up. ” – Confused old man

                      Note the little red line that swiftly rises to a point where the earth is no warmer than at any time in the last 120,000 years.

                      That ain’t what normally happens, old man.

                    • Typical lying and deception from global warming alarmists. You KNOW your chart is only of the past few thousand years and shows ONLY that today’s temperature is just barely warmer than a few thousand years ago. That left scale says about 0.2 degrees warmer. The low point on your chart is referred to as the little ice age around 1600. 400 years ago. since then your chart shows a constant rate of temperature increase. Hello??? From 1600 to what… 1950(? 1900? what date do you choose?) THERE WAS NO WHERE NEAR THE CO2 INPUT FROM MAN AS THE PAST 50 OR 60 YEARS!!!!! YET THE RATE OF INCREASE IS THE SAME!!!!

                      I will attempt to show your chart in perspective by showing your hockey stick over the past hundred years or so and a chart that I have linked previously that includes the highs of all interglacial warmups of the past 400,000 years which today’s temperature will not reach at the hockey stick rate for another 400 to 800 years.
                      Note that the far right yellow bar is your chart in perspective. And the other chart shows your hockey stick in the perspective of the past 100 plus years.

                      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/f9fabfc6ac119e97f312ef8e81b0506ee683c6467606522130f56f0eb36df0aa.gif

                      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/76470609a203f11e776d2a9d16faa77c06e9506eb90366daa228e68bf88e4c00.png

                    • “You KNOW your chart is only of the past few thousand years and shows ONLY that today’s temperature is just barely warmer than a few thousand years ago. ” – Old Man

                      Current Global temperatures are warmer than at any time in the last 120,000 years.

                      This will be true only for another 30 years or so, and then the global average will be higher than at any time in several million years.

                      You will of course be dead, and the world will be a smarter place as a result.

                    • DUH. 120,000 years ago was after the last warm up which you only need to go back another 10,000 years and you statement is false. So you are projecting that the average earth temperature will rise 3 or more degrees in the next 30 years??? LMFAO!!! That is as good a projection as Gore made when he said the earth temperature will increase and the oceans will rise 14 feet by 2010. LOL. You really are an idiot.

                    • “is just barely warmer than a few thousand years ago. That left scale says about 0.2 degrees warmer.” – Old Man

                      And prior to 12,000 years ago the earth was experiencing a glacial period where the earth’s temperature was several degrees colder on average.

                      Even your own chart shows it.

                    • Again what is your point? DUH… yes … hello??!!?? the glacial cool down and interglacial warm up have occurred in an almost identical pattern as the current interglacial warm up is progressing. These facts that the climate alarmists deniers ignore in all their computer models and projections. And they wonder why their projections are always wrong. Your red line is WRONG as the current 2015 temperature is not yet above the 1997 peak in that chart but in the plateau since this is a 2007 chart. However I expect the average earth temperature will eventually rise 3 or 4 more degrees as it has in every other interglacial warm up.

                    • “The low point on your chart is referred to as the little ice age around 1600. 400 years ago. since then your chart shows a constant rate of temperature increase. Hello??? : – Old Man

                      Hello!!!

                    • What is your point,Idiot? You do realize that that chart is an averaging of many speculated isolated temperatures around the world to create a smoothed graph that does in no way represent reality only a guestimate.
                      Your temperature rise hockey stick since the little ice age, began at a rate of less than 1/2 degree per 100 years for about 300 years and the last 1/4 is the approximate 1 degree per 100 years. So what is your problem??? besides stupidity and deception.

                    • “I have linked previously that includes the highs of all interglacial warmups of the past 400,000 years which today’s temperature will not reach at the hockey stick rate for another 400 to 800 years.” – Old Man

                      Meanwhile. Back on planet Reality.

                    • Are you really that stupid or do you think you are fooling someone? First, that chart ends in 2007 The high temperature at the end of that chart was achieved in 1997. Since 1997 the average earth temperature has been in a plateau and has not yet been proven to exceed that 1997 temperature high. However, I expect it to move out of the plateau since every interglacial warm up in that chart has exceeded your green line. Your red extension claiming to be the current temperature is BS sine the recent 1997 high has not yet been exceeded. That yellow shaded area represents about 10,000 years. On the far right where the black line ends, look closely, you can make out the 1997 peak and see the 2007 end is below it. The 2015 temperature would perhaps be right at the 1997 peak. Certainly not about 1 degree above as you suggest. Over the past 130 years, the average earth temperature has risen about 1/2 degree on 2 occasions reaching a multi decade plateau each time before continuing at the average rate of about 1 degree per 100 years.
                      Your green line absolutely makes my point that even at the extremely rapid increase of 1 degree per 100 years, it will take minimally 300 to 400 years to reach your green line let alone exceed it.

                    • You do not have any idea what you are talking about. That chart only goes back 10,000 years not 120,000 years. And your hockey stick is a 400 year period of 2 degree temperature rise. If you look at the yellow bar chart, your chart is only the yellow area of the last 10,000 years but based on an averaging of disjointed temperature estimates over the past 10,000 years . NOAA posted the chart with the yellow areas because this is a scientifically peer reviewed study of the dome fuji ice core samples not some deceptive short time frame with speculated temperatures averaged out.
                      I have already shown you the far right of your chart in a more honest display previously. https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/76470609a203f11e776d2a9d16faa77c06e9506eb90366daa228e68bf88e4c00.png

                    • Climate corruption, it is amazing how many Ex NASA project scientists after leaving NASA, announce their Skeptic ways…something about paychecks, funding and keeping a job in the most politically corrupt administration I have ever seen…IRS, DOJ, EPA, NASA…amazing the stuff warmists consume

                    • So I assume you want to have the world spend $89 Trillion at a $2 Trillion a year run rate to stop warming? And if so, are you for new nuclear?

                    • A bargoon.

                      America spent 4 trillion to kill one man – Saddam – and create ISIS.

                      Now there was money wasted.

                    • But then you would have to contend with me and many like me as your enemy.

                      and I wouldn’t be a nice a ISIS.

                    • When you lose on the truth of the issues ad homonym attacks work wonders. Sling mud and name call when you lose on the truth.

                    • No he says it because his bosses would remove him if he said otherwise… and for no other reason than his disagreement with the liberal alarmist agenda.

                  • It was so funny to see Anthony Watts after a decade of claiming that the UHA was seriously confounding global temperature estimates, forced to eat his words when his own analysis proved himself to be wrong.

                    Ahahahahahah…… What a moron.

                    • It was so funny to see Anthony Watts after a decade of claiming that the UHA was seriously confounding global temperature estimates, forced to eat his words when his own analysis proved himself to be wrong.

                      Ahahahahahah…… What a moron.

                    • It’s funny how alarmists find one person who says something they like and they are considered an unimpeachable source yet when they find a source that is a thorn in their side, they attack them as shills for big oil. 555555555555555555555555555555555555555555. (the 5 is easier and you may or may not know it means the same thing as your pathetic haha….

                    • I didn’t say RSS didn’t go through adjustments. I say the ALARMISTS can’t adjust RSS numbers. You most likely know how easy it is to get the answer you are looking for with minor adjustments.

                    • I know of no falsified models. If you have falsified any then please write a paper and submit it to a peer reviewed journal.

                    • Not falsified models, Models that have failed in their predictions because their data is defective. Because they ignore the most powerful naturally occurring climate forcing event they call “the 100,000 year problem.” Here is the NOAA graph of that problem that shows we remain 2 to 4 degrees cooler than every inter-glacial high temperature of the past 500,000 years

                      http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/abrupt/data2.html

                    • You mean the same models that can’t predict the weather 24 hours in advance, let alone 10 days or 10 years. You are quite the naive fool.

                    • You don’t seem to know the difference between weather and climate.

                      That makes you spectacularly ignorant.

                    • Only as ignorant as all the alarmists that point to any weather event as proof of climate change and predict weather changes of more severe weather which did not happen. DUH

                    • Typically scientists go out of their way to state that no single climate event can definitively be said to have been caused by global warming.

                      You must be a Faux news viewer. You are in their very old, very confused white guy, demographic.

                    • The scientists on occasion do point that out. Usually they ignore the subject. However, the MSM reports on single events and non-science alarmists that do claim they are caused by global warming… let alone all the blogs and editorial and other cartoons. You deny reality and desire to deceive as much as all other true believers in the man caused global warming religion.

                    • You mean the same average that can’t predict the height of the next child to walk into a room but can predict the average height of those students 10 years in the future?

                      My god you are stupid.

                    • You are right. By 2110 the earth will be as warm or warmer than it has been in the last half million years.

                    • LOL! Another WRONG prediction just like all the bogus predictions from the global warming “scientists” that have been proven wrong by the real events. Based on the extremely rapid rate of temperature rise of .5 degrees centigrade that began in the late 1800’s, it will take 400 to 800 years to reach the normal highs of every inter-glacial warm up of the past 500,000 years as the black temperature line on this NOAA chart so vividly points out.

                      http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/abrupt/data2.html

                    • “Models” confirm. Not observation. Not evidence. “Models”.
                      Do you even see the ridiculousness of what you just said?

                      Warming does not cause cooling. It’s either warming, or it’s not.

          • actually some people do a decent job of forecasting the weather up to a year in advance with accuracy around 80%+…except they do it through observing solar activity and have enough integrity to admit when they don’t know something and don’t blow smoke up our asses that it’s caused by AGW

                • You knowledge speaks of arrogant ignorance. Newton wasn’t just wrong he was very wrong. You dont say “universal law of Gravitation” you say “Newtonian Gravity” because its incomplete.

                  You cant win against me because you are stupid.

                    • Newton made many errors and the biggest error was for others to call it a law. There is no such law. If it was a law it would have been correct. Its not. Today it is correct to say “Newtonian Gravity” because its not a law. There are still huge arguments in science over gravity and its nature. There is no law.

                      Face it you are stupid. You did a quick google and got the wrong anser because you were stupid enough to trust google. Obviously you are a melenial.

                    • So It’s not a law when everyone says it is because you say it isn’t.

                      Sorry boy, but your kookie opinions are bring nothing but laughter to the floor.

                    • No stupid kids call it a law because Google said so. There is no law. At one point in time over a hundred years ago people thought it was a law but it was ultimately proven incorrect. Its called Newtonian Gravity because its an imperfect approximation.

                      Do you realize that you have an 19th century understanding of science? My god you are dumb.

                    • Sorry boy, but Newtons Universal Law of gravitation was called a universal law of gravitation long centuries before Google existed.

                      My goodness you are ignorant.

                      “it was ultimately proven incorrect.”

                      Really? What has Newton’s universal law of gravitation been replaced with?

                    • Do you have any evidence that Einsteinian laws of gravity are incomplete?

                      Nope.

                      And even if they were incomplete, they would still be laws. Just like the Newtonian law of Universal Gravitation.

                    • Your article link ends with….

                      “So what’s the matter with gravity? It may or may not be related to dark energy and it doesn’t fit in with the other forces. If it’s not a particle or a wave, then what else it might be is unclear. “And that’s where it sits now,””

                      In other words nothing is wrong with gravity.

                      Kooooooooooooook.

                    • It is PBS science pablum for the Scientifically illiterate American public.

                      It is a shame what Republicans have done to PBS. NOVA used to be very good. Now it is flashy, superficial, claptrap dumbed down for a sack of door knobs I.E. the American public.

                    • The science of gravity has been settled since the time of Newton. What isn’t settled are some trivial details that don’t alter any of the real world predictions of Newton.

                      Similarly none of the conclusions of the science of Global Warming will be overturned by the few second and higher order details that are still not explained.

                      Only the truly ignorant presume that because something is not known, nothing is known.

                    • Like not knowing why the 100,000 year glacial cycle over powers the 40,000 year orbital cycle as the most powerful naturally occurring climate forcing event. Math and science, as they exist today, do not understand it and cannot explain it, so it is ignored and not included in any climate models. Then they wonder why all their predictions are proven false. Maybe some day their science and math will be advanced enough to be able to accurately predict when the earth’s average temperature will rise 2 to 4 degrees to the highs of all inter-glacial warmups of the past 500,000 years as is easily seen on this NOAA graph

                      http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/abrupt/data2.html

                    • Actually Newton admitted he had no idea what gravity was. He came up with some equations that worked most of the time. It took Einstein to come up with a theory of gravity.

                    • And noone still has the slightest inkling of what it IS.
                      We know many of its attributes. We are able to predict planetary motion and ballistic trajectories with great certainty using the rules of Newton and Einstein.
                      But noone knows what gravity IS!
                      I really need to buy a new can of Troll-Be-Gone.

                    • Gravity is a region of space that contains more space than it should by simply projecting the space around it.

                      It manifests as a higher local vacuum energy density which pretend to be an expansion of space.

                    • Higher concentrations of vacuum energy = more space under the observation that vacuum energy has a constant local energy density as observed by an observer in that space.

                    • I do deny it. Newton formulated a theory which applied to the “universe” as he knew it at the time. His theory held up to scrutiny given the available tests and data available at the time. Discoveries since then show his theory breaks down when you begin discussing Relativity, which goodspkr rightly points out.

                    • Everybody who is jumping on Vedicar over the “law of gravitation” is wrong. A scientific law is not an explanation, it is an observation of some aspect of the universe. Things fall toward each other. That is a law, a law of gravity. Why they fall toward each other is left to someone to explain. Einstein explained gravity with his theories. Einstein’s ideas are not “laws”, they are theories. They try to explain a law. Newton stated a law of gravity but said he didn’t know what gravity was. Einstein explained how he thought it worked, but the law still stands. The problem is semantics. Even scientists sometimes use the term “law” and “theory” interchangeably and incorrectly.

                    • Either will do, since violating one within it’s regime of applicability necessarily violates the other.

                    • Not even close. First of all if it is a law and you violate it, it isn’t a law anymore because you can’t violate.it. You don’t give us much to go on but so far your batting .000.

                    • Who told you that, Child?

                      if it wasn’t for electrons violating the law of conservation of energy by tunneling through the potential barrier in transistors you would not be having this conversation.

                      My goodness you are an idiot.

                • Fool.

                  “uncertainty, and this experience is of very great importance, I think. When a scientist doesn’t
                  know the answer to a problem, he is ignorant. When he has a hunch as to what
                  the result is, he is uncertain. And when he is pretty damn sure of what the
                  result is going to be, he is still in some doubt. We have found it of paramount
                  importance that in order to progress, we must recognize our ignorance and leave
                  room for doubt. Scientific knowledge is a body of statements of varying degrees
                  of certainty — some most unsure, some nearly sure, but none absolutely certain.
                  Now, we scientists are used to this, and we take it for granted that it is
                  perfectly consistent to be unsure, that it is possible to live and not know.
                  But I don’t know whether everyone realizes this is true. Our freedom to doubt
                  was born out of a struggle against authority in the early days of science. It
                  was a very deep and strong struggle: permit us to question — to doubt — to not
                  be sure. I think that it is important that we do not forget this struggle and
                  thus perhaps lose what we have gained.”― Richard Feynman

                  The fascists in climate change are willing to throw away true science for 30 pieces of silver. Of course
                  the keep getting that silver year after year after year.

          • here you go: “A key difference between meteorologists and climatologists lies in the time perspectives they bring to the study of weather and climate. Meteorologists produce forecasts that are intended to predict weather conditions over the short term, often a horizon no longer than 7 to 10 days. Climatologists, meanwhile, employ a long-term perspective, developing and analyzing models that are designed to predict changes in weather patterns in the months and years to come. A meteorologist will predict whether it will rain in the next day or two, but a climatologist will predict whether climate patterns will result in more rainfall on average in the years to come.” http://work.chron.com/climatol

          • here you go: “A key difference between meteorologists and climatologists lies in the time perspectives they bring to the study of weather and climate. Meteorologists produce forecasts that are intended to predict weather conditions over the short term, often a horizon no longer than 7 to 10 days. Climatologists, meanwhile, employ a long-term perspective, developing and analyzing models that are designed to predict changes in weather patterns in the months and years to come. A meteorologist will predict whether it will rain in the next day or two, but a climatologist will predict whether climate patterns will result in more rainfall on average in the years to come.” http://work.chron.com/climatologist-vs-meteorologist-16462.html

                • Are you motivated by your holdings in carbon credit stocks ? Perhaps your sustenance depends of government research grants ? Maybe you wish to be popular with left wing hedonists and your worldview is focused through your libido ? Could it be that you are a doctrinaire materialist Marxist who obsesses over the wealth of your neighbor, your envy driving you to support those that wish to seize and redistribute it ? OR Maybe you are just a fool ?
                  I really don’t know or care. I do know that it is you that is spreading childish delusion.

                    • That was the warmest year in the U.S. PopTart. Not the warmest year globally.

                      The U.S. only comprises about 2% of the earths surface.

                      You are clearly ignorant.

                    • I do not obsess over the sky falling.
                      For every political scientist you name touting the environmental redistribution of wealth, I can refer you to ten (real) scientists that are skeptics of both the motivation and the bogus models coming out of the watermelon movement.
                      Go away “bouy” ! Ya bother me.

                    • Given that 98% of the worlds scientists support the view that the anthropomorphic emission of CO2 is causing the globe to warm, it would appear tat your claim is a mathematically impossible lie.

                      Do you intend to remain a liar for the rest of your life?

                    • “Do you intend to remain a liar for the rest of your life?”. You cannot even be truthful about the number of scientists that are “onboard” with your “theory” of man made global warming.

                      When may we expect to hear that popping sound from you ? (The sound of your head snapping out of your sphincter).

                    • Well, you global warmist clown, the hottest temperature ever record in Djibouti was 151 degrees in 2003. The temperature average has never gone above 121degrees since then. It is one of the hottest countries on the planet, yet it holds no records. Wait, what? Where is Djibouti you ask? On the equatorial belt of Africa. A total African desert. Seems like things have been getting a bit cooler over the past 13 years in Africa. And I was there that day. The average temperature AND the climate for my home in Florida, my ski digs in the Rocky mountains nor my house in San Diego has never varied in over 30 years. Isn’t that time frame you alarmist use to measure the climate?

                    • “Well, you global warmist clown, the hottest temperature ever record in Djibouti was 151 degrees in 2003.” – Kook

                      You aren’t one of those kooks that try to claim that all of the worlds surface will rise at a uniform rate everywhere in the world are you?

                      That would be spectacularly stupid for anyone to do, wouldn’t it?

                    • Considering the average mean temperature hasn’t changed across the African equatorial band in over 30 years I’d say things have been pretty much stable. Humidity has remained constant. Sand and wind storms have remained constant.s And that land mass eclipses the length of the U.S. (which hasn’t had any significant warming either). I have homes in three separate climate areas in the U.S. nothing has changed. But keep drinking your Kool Aid.

            • As a bunkologist, I debunk theories in years to come. AGW will be thrown on the dustbin of history just like the ice age warnings of the 1970s. By then, the AGW crowd will have moved on to some other scheme to reallocate taxpayers’ money.

                    • You do realize that even Mann admitted that his hockey stick may have been flawed? Which most certainly means it was.

                      The folks that claim it was hottest year ever purposefully skipped satellite and ocean data, and only used US based land instruments, most of which have been encroached on by growing cites over the last 20 years… meaning comparative data is useless. Nice try Vendicar, but that claim has been thoroughly debunked.

                    • Mann’s hockey stick now has a couple dozen cousins.

                      That makes me laugh, and makes you Denialists crap your diapers.

                    • All of which have undergone serious adjustments lowering past temperatures and raising recent temperatures.In 2007 NASA/GISS published a list of the ten warmest years and 4 of the top ten occurred before 1940. 1934 was the warmest followed by 1921. After the massaging and adjustment none of the pre-1940 years were in the top ten.You might recall that NASA reported wrong temperature data for 2000-2006,higher of course,until caught out by Mr McIntyre.
                      Still asking for the real data for the 120,000 years.

                    • Liar… Liar.. Pants on fire…

                      “In 2007 NASA/GISS published a list of the ten warmest years and 4 of the top ten occurred before 1940. 1934 ” – Mosman

                      Those were the warmest years in the continental U.S. Not the warmest years globally.

                      So why do you feel a need to lie about it?

                      Ahahahahahahahahah

                    • And then there is more recent NASA/GISS tampering with temperature data.

                      http://notrickszone.com/2012/03/01/data-tamperin-giss-caught-red-handed-manipulaing-data-to-produce-arctic-climate-history-revision/

                      Another NASA (Hansen) adjustment, this time the whole country of Iceland was secretly warmed up.

                      http://newsweekly.com.au/article.php?id=5070

                      Icelandic officials rejected the “adjusted” warmer temperatures out of hand.http://moyhu.blogspot.com/2012
                      Apparently NASA didn’t restrict its tampering to the US.

                      He who laughs last laughs best.

                    • You link to an op ed piece in an Australian right wing rag that was written by an employee The National Civic Council, which is an Australian Conservative Christian lobby group.

                      You can’t get much more Kook Tard than that.

                      Virtually all of the temperature “adjustmets” that the wingers crap their pants over are made as a result of the nonstandard hour of reporting that many U.S. stations used. Some would report morning measurements, others, evening, and over the course of decades the measurement times have become standard.

                      So there are corrections to compensate for the different observing times on some stations.

                    • So “measurement times have become standard.” means all temperatures prior to the 1990s were cooled and all temperatures after 1998 were warmed up. A statistical impossibility. By the way all these revisions were made by government employees aided and abetted by government funded academics and it is known the he who pays the piper calls the tune. Time to sign off as you can lead a
                      AGW fanatics to the truth and facts but you can’t make them think for themselves.

            • If models based on comprehensive data gathered under known circumstances applied on a limited scale across a short time horizon for a restricted area of homogenous character can’t make accurate predictions, why would you believe that models based on incomplete data gathered under poorly controlled conditions applied on a long time scale across a whole planet can?

              • Oh. It is because averages capture the evolution of a system more precisely than the moment to moment noise in the system.

                That is why the concept of an averaging was invented.

                Your education is clearly lacking.

                • Statistical averaging isn’t magic. In can’t make stochastic phenomena not be stochastic, and if anyone is lacking education, it’s you in the subject of common courtesy. Insulting people isn’t an argument.

                  • Stochastic phenomenon are not stochastic over all intervals. That is why averaging was invented.

                    If the weather was stochastic over all intervals then there would be no distinction between winter and summer, and no statistical difference between fall and summer.

                    Yet there are such differences which indicates that there is an underlying pattern to the noise.

                    And that is why averaging is applicable.

                    • I agree with you that averaging is applicable in these sorts of statistical models, my point is that it can’t really compensate for a dataset that is incomplete and corrupted by poor collection methods.
                      A model can be perfectly valid statistically, but if the values you plug into the variables are themselves of questionable validity your results are meaningless.

                    • Data sets are used to initialize the models, and not used during their operation except for the parameterization of some things like plant growth response to CO2 uptake etc.

                      It is self evident that what you do not know is that these models which are run hundreds of times and averaged, is that the initialization data is randomly altered to allow the model to explore different evolutionary pathways.

                      The model result is the average of those paths through modeling space.

                      This is why it is laughable when ignorant nincompoops claim that the models are wrong when they don’t capture some element of the weather.

                      They are programmed specifically to average away weather.

              • Sorry deadbeat, but there was no warning from the scientific community of an imminent ice age back in the 1960’s.

                In fact it has been known for almost 150 years that adding CO2 to the atmosphere would warm the planet.

                A crude but still accurate back of the envelope calculation was done back then by Lord Kelvin who showed a 2 to 3 ‘C warming could be expected.

                My goodness you are ignorant.

              • sure do. if you actually research that story, you’ll find that there were indeed a handful of reports on a theory of global cooling. but you’ll also find that aside from that handful of articles, there was no widespread investigation/scientific corroboration of that theory, and certainly nowhere near the investigation/tools/researches that have been employed to investigate AGW theory, which is why the reports were more in the category of “one and done”. Moral of the story: just because Time magazine ran one article back in the 70’s about the potential of global cooling does not equate with the current scientific studies on this issue. Here’s a cogent explanation of what transpired: http://www.skepticalscience.com/ice-age-predictions-in-1970s-intermediate.htm
                I know-you just hate, hate, hate this answer.

                • You got me wrong. I don’t hate to the degree and throw a temper tantrum like VendicarDecarian0 if I don’t get the answer I want or somebody doesn’t post the way I want them to post on any of these sites. According to you, you’re on the side of science and in my own mind I’m on the side of science. I just don’t believe it’s settled science which I believe is coming from your camp. However, I will watch your link with an open mind.

                  • well, that’s refreshing. I don’t claim that it’s “settled” science either (whatever that may actually mean). but I do not subscribe to the notion that the vast majority of climate scientists are engaged in some Grand Conspiracy to dupe the general public. And I do subscribe to the concept that, in theory, the more heat-trapping gases are introduced into the atmosphere, the more likely it is that those gases will actually trap heat.

                    • Settled science is a conclusion Al Gore coined. I don’t think AGW is all that big a thing. Hey, we’re still here and there are more Polar Bears now than there were when Al Gore started this whole propaganda campaign. I’m sixty three years old and AGW hasn’t killed me yet. I know I’m going to get called a simpleton for saying that, but I don’t care.

          • Weather prediction involves the time evolution of the atmosphere on a minute by minute basis for periods as long as a week or two.

            Climate prediction involved the time evolution of average weather over periods of 30 years or more.

            if you don’t know the difference then you are too ignorant to be commenting on either.

        • Inability to make proper forecasts is relevant even if they are different phenomena. The fact is that when a “scientific” organisation makes a forecast, if it does not come true, their credibility is called into question. If they were not relatively certain of the outcome, they should not have made a public forecast. See how this works?

          • sure do. and as a matter of fact, if you check with a meteorologist, you’ll discovery that predictions/forecasts of upcoming local weather events are generally accurate-over 90% of the time, if you’re referring to 1-3 day forecasts. Obviously, the farther out you get, the less accuracy you get. But that applies to what most folks refer to as weather forecasts. Climatology is an entirely different area. But of course you knew that….

        • Do you know anything about the limitations of science and the history of massive failures in science? The history of science is littered with politically motivated theories that were propped up and then turned out to be basically propaganda.

            • (1) Paul Broca’s work on intelligence and race. (2) Samuel George Morton’s work on “craniometry” and intelligence (3) Take a look at Stephen Jay Gould’s book the Mismeasure of Man. (3) John Down’s work stating that “ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny. (4) the steady state theory of the universe, which was advocated against the big bang because it implied no creator. (5) Einstein’s beliefs and work towards overthrowing quantum mechanics because he didn’t like its implications. (6) Einstein’s use of a cosmological constant because he did not like the idea that the universe might be expanding or contracting. Science is littered with unscientific and often politically motivated ideas. Do you want more?

        • “someone doesn’t know the difference between weather prediction and the science of climatology”

          Let me help,
          Climate: when a weather event suits the alarmist agenda.
          Weather: when a weather event does not suit the alarmist agenda

        • Well, since the predictions of the rate of increase in global temperatures has little relationship to reality as traced by HadCRUT4 and UAH satellite data, I suppose they are just as incompetent at climate projections.

          • naw. if you’re referring to what most folks refer to as weather forecasts, for 1-3 days the accuracy is over 90%. The longer range forecasts are less accurate. But that’s as to the science of localized weather forecasting. Climatology is an entirely different animal, with different tools, analysis, etc. since it’s not about whether it’s going to rain in Chicago on Wednesday.

        • Climatology is not accurate without solar models and NASA has updated those again so there really is not that much difference. That is not even accounting the idea that one dormant volcano becomes active and the models have to be adjusted as well. 30 year predictions are a joke.

        • Well I know the difference and I remember when we were all supposed to be shaking in our boots over GLOBAL COOLING. I didn’t believe it then and I don’t believe it NOW! SAME IDIOTS TRYING TO CLAIM THE SAME HOAX TO SHUT